[WSMDiscuss] World Social Forum: Pre-call to movements
Francine Mestrum
mestrum at skynet.be
Fri May 8 13:13:51 CEST 2020
If you have evidence Azril, than give it.
This is outrageous!
Francine
Op 08/05/2020 om 12:37 schreef Azril Bacal Roij:
> Dear Jai and All,
> My perception might be wrong, but it stands to reason.
> Actually, I wished to be wrong. But I have evidence otherwise!
> It was an amazing coincidence of synchronic presence in space and time!
> I am clearly not gaining popularity votes 😀
> /Azril
>
> El vie., 8 may. 2020 a las 11:34, Francine Mestrum via WSM-Discuss
> (<wsm-discuss at lists.openspaceforum.net
> <mailto:wsm-discuss at lists.openspaceforum.net>>) escribió:
>
> Dear Jai,
>
> Thanks once again for all your efforts concerning the possibly
> upcoming WSF.
>
> And thanks to Rita, Carminda and Azril for answering, Azril
> unfortunately repeating his ugly suspicions.
>
> Chico obviously will not answer, as he did not answer my last
> email to him.
>
> Carminda's offer is very welcome. The matter is we do listen to
> each other, but one part is not moving at all, talking and
> dialoguing is meant to reach a compromise, I thought, and that
> does not happen.
>
> And so I will never know why we cannot discuss Boa's proposal,
> what is wrong with it, and why it is not enough to respect the
> Charter of principles.
>
> I think the discussion stops here, I wish the organizers a lot of
> luck. It was not the effort to talk that was lacking.
>
> Francine
>
>
> Op 05/05/2020 om 18:06 schreef Francine Mestrum via WSM-Discuss:
>>
>> Dear Jai,
>>
>> Thank you so very much for your answer. I fully understand your
>> reasoning and highly apporeciate the efforts your are making.
>>
>> I understand my letter may have surprised you, but you should
>> know that it is the result of several meetings and notes of the
>> past months. I spend almost 6 months in Mexico last winter, so I
>> was able to attend several meetings and have seen the situation
>> worsening.
>>
>> I will certainly not bother you with all the details of the
>> sometimes difficult discussions. I just add the French and
>> English version of a note of mid- February that will clarify what
>> is happening.
>>
>> Thanks a lot and let us hope this will bring a positive solution.
>>
>> Francine
>>
>> Op 05/05/2020 om 16:48 schreef Jai Sen:
>>>
>>> Tuesday, May 5, 2020
>>>
>>> Dear Francine
>>>
>>> Thank you so much for sharing with us all this
>>> absolutely frank, and straightforward, letter that you have sent
>>> to the members of the WSF International Council. I am stunned
>>> to read what you have to say. And I’m now so glad I asked you
>>> to come in and comment – though I never expected that this would
>>> be the kind of thing that you might have to say.
>>>
>>> In responding, I of course have to say that we have to see what
>>> you have shared with us as of course only one opinion of what
>>> took place at the meeting in Porto Alegre in January. But
>>> nevertheless, what you have said remains stunning, and of course
>>> so deeply disappointing to hear. And if I may add this, I also
>>> personally feel so much for you given the crushing
>>> disappointment you must now be feeling, given – as all of us who
>>> have been involved with the organisational aspects of the WSF
>>> know – the many, many years that you have devoted to the WSF,
>>> and the hope you have invested in it… and especially at this
>>> historical juncture.
>>>
>>> It is of course not for me to comment as yet on what you have
>>> said beyond what I've said above, and so what I'm doing is
>>> taking the liberty of copying in here two people I know and
>>> respect and who I see from the documents that Tord circulated
>>> were present at the Porto Alegre meeting, Chico Whitaker and
>>> Carminda Mac Lorin, /with the very personal request to each of
>>> you – Chico and Carminda – to please respond and give your
>>> comments on the Porto Alegre meeting and on what Francine has
>>> said here/.
>>>
>>> (For those on this list who do not know this, Chico Whitaker (of
>>> Brazil) was one of the founders of the World Social Forum, and
>>> is widely seen – in his own words ! – as ‘one of the uncles of
>>> the Forum’; and Carminda Mac Lorin was one of the main
>>> organisers of the FSM / WSF in Montreal in 2016.)
>>>
>>> I am also copying in another person who has also
>>> been deeply involved with the WSF over many years and who in the
>>> past decade was particularly engaged, at strategic levels, and
>>> who I deeply respect, Gustave Massiah, of France; for any
>>> comments you would like to add.
>>>
>>> Let me only add that this return to this subject, on
>>> this list - World Social Movement Discuss, which grew out of an
>>> earlier list ‘World Social Forum Discuss’ -, is especially
>>> meaningful : Because this is precisely why some of us set up the
>>> WSFDiscuss list in the first place, in 2006, as an independent
>>> ‘open space’ for the horizontal sharing of information on the
>>> World Social Forum and for critical discussion of what it was
>>> doing, all in order to help strengthen the great social and
>>> political experiment that had by then been nicknamed ‘the Forum’.
>>>
>>> I therefore now hope that we might again be able to do so here
>>> on this list, even now… and I am therefore deeply hopeful that
>>> Chico, Carminda, and Gustave, you will reply. Please…
>>>
>>> With thanks, and in hope,
>>>
>>> Jai
>>>
>>> Copy : Chico Whitaker, Carminda Mac Lorin, Gustave Massiah
>>>
>>>
>>>> On May 5, 2020, at 4:17 AM, Francine Mestrum via WSM-Discuss
>>>> <wsm-discuss at lists.openspaceforum.net
>>>> <mailto:wsm-discuss at lists.openspaceforum.net>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Since Jai, asked my opinion, this is the letter I just sent to
>>>> the International Council of the WSF:
>>>>
>>>> Dear friends of the International Council,
>>>>
>>>> You will have received the documents of the Facilitating
>>>> Committee of the WSF Mexico with a pre-invitation.
>>>>
>>>> I would like to explain very briefly why I voted ‘no’ to this
>>>> proposal. I think that, at this moment, the Committee is not
>>>> able to organize a Social Forum.
>>>>
>>>> 1)The Committee is extremely weak and all but democratic.
>>>> Comments and questions of those who do not totally agree with
>>>> the proposals are simply ignored. It is a very weird
>>>> interpretation of what they see as ‘consensus’. For instance,
>>>> as the thematic axes necessarily have to be the result of the
>>>> proposals of participating movements, I proposed a simple
>>>> framework within which these proposals can be integrated.
>>>> Nevertheless, the group continues to work with a predetermined
>>>> list of axes in which even the struggles against
>>>> authoritarianism and fascism are failing! You will understand
>>>> that various organisations already have left this facilitating
>>>> committee.
>>>>
>>>> 2)In 2021 the WSF will celebrate its 20^th anniversary! This is
>>>> an excellent opportunity to invite movements and organisations
>>>> that till now did not take part in the Forum so that the
>>>> process can be enlarged. It is also an opportunity to reflect
>>>> and discuss the rules and principles of the WSF. This is what a
>>>> small group of members of the IC has proposed. They want to
>>>> organize, inside the Forum, a debate on the relevance of the
>>>> Charter of Principles after 20 years. For these two reasons,
>>>> they propose to ask all facilitators and participants in the
>>>> Forum not to ‘agree with the Charter of Principles’ but to
>>>> ‘respect the Charter of Principles’. This simple change is also
>>>> totally rejected and people are asked to sign a ‘letter of
>>>> commitment’ of two full pages!
>>>>
>>>> In other words, the current process is excluding and
>>>> bureaucratic and it lacks the most minimal sense of democracy.
>>>> I could give you many other examples. Without fundamental
>>>> changes, I cannot participate in such a process. After almost
>>>> twenty years of work for and in the WSF, this really hurts. But
>>>> I think that all persons and all opinions deserve some respect.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Op 04/05/2020 om 23:02 schreef Tord Björk via WSM-Discuss:
>>>>> FIY
>>>>> Tord Björk
>>>>>
>>>>> email: tord.bjork at gmail.com <mailto:tord.bjork at gmail.com>,
>>>>> skype: tordbjork, tel: +46 (0)722 15 16 90
>>>>> address: Götgatan 7 A, 29133 Kristianstad, Sweden
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ---------- Forwarded message ---------
>>>>> From: *Mirek Prokeš* <mirek.prokes at gmail.com
>>>>> <mailto:mirek.prokes at gmail.com>>
>>>>> Date: Mon, May 4, 2020 at 10:39 PM
>>>>> Subject: World Social Forum: Pre-call to movements
>>>>> To: Tord Björk <tord.bjork at gmail.com
>>>>> <mailto:tord.bjork at gmail.com>>
>>>>> Cc: Balint <balint at unitedagainstracism.org
>>>>> <mailto:balint at unitedagainstracism.org>>, helga suleiman
>>>>> <helga.suleiman at gmail.com <mailto:helga.suleiman at gmail.com>>,
>>>>> Viktor Koren <viktor at iynf.org <mailto:viktor at iynf.org>>, Leo
>>>>> Gabriel <lgabriel at gmx.net <mailto:lgabriel at gmx.net>>, igor
>>>>> <igorgotlib0 at gmail.com <mailto:igorgotlib0 at gmail.com>>, matyas
>>>>> benyik <benyikmatyas at gmail.com
>>>>> <mailto:benyikmatyas at gmail.com>>, Aktivister för Fred
>>>>> <aktivisterforfred at gmail.com
>>>>> <mailto:aktivisterforfred at gmail.com>>, Dagmar Svendova
>>>>> <svendova at transform-network.net
>>>>> <mailto:svendova at transform-network.net>>, Bilinç Sezgin
>>>>> <bilinc at yeenet.eu <mailto:bilinc at yeenet.eu>>, Marek Hrubec
>>>>> <marek.hrubec at gmail.com <mailto:marek.hrubec at gmail.com>>,
>>>>> Kavan Jan <kavanjan17 at gmail.com <mailto:kavanjan17 at gmail.com>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Dear friends and comrades,
>>>>>
>>>>> three months after the meeting of the International Council in
>>>>> Porto Alegre, it has today published the attached call and
>>>>> conclusions of the meeting (by consensus).
>>>>> Please spread the call, e.g. post it on your websites and
>>>>> facebook pages/groups.
>>>>>
>>>>> Have a good evening,
>>>>>
>>>>> Mirek
>>>>>
>>>>> ________________________________________
>>>>> ** Inspired by the World Social Forum, WSMDiscuss – the successor to a list named ‘WSFDiscuss’ started in 2005 - is an open, unmoderated, and self-organising forum for the exchange of information and views on the experience, practice, and theory of social and political movement at any level (local, national, regional, and global), including the World Social Forum. Join in ! **
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>>>> ________________________________________
>>>> ** Inspired by the World Social Forum, WSMDiscuss – the
>>>> successor to a list named ‘WSFDiscuss’ started in 2005 - is an
>>>> open, unmoderated, and self-organising forum for the exchange
>>>> of information and views on the experience, practice, and
>>>> theory of social and political movement at any level (local,
>>>> national, regional, and global), including the World Social
>>>> Forum. Join in ! **
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>>>
>>> ____________________________
>>>
>>> Jai Sen
>>>
>>> Independent researcher, editor; Senior Fellow at the School of
>>> International Development and Globalisation Studies at the
>>> University of Ottawa
>>>
>>> jai.sen at cacim.net <mailto:jai.sen at cacim.net>
>>>
>>> Now based in New Delhi, India (+91-98189 11325) and in Ottawa,
>>> Canada,on unceded and unsurrendered Anishinaabe
>>> territory(+1-613-282 2900)
>>>
>>> CURRENT / RECENT publications:
>>>
>>> Jai Sen, ed, 2018a –*/The Movements of Movements, Part 2 :
>>> Rethinking Our Dance/*. Ebook and hard copy available atPM Press
>>> <http://www.pmpress.org/>
>>>
>>> Jai Sen, ed, 2018b –*/The Movements of Movements, Part 1 : What
>>> Makes Us Move ?/*(Indian edition). New Delhi : AuthorsUpfront,
>>> in collaboration with OpenWord andPM Press.Hard copy available
>>> atMOM1AmazonIN
>>> <https://www.amazon.in/dp/9387280101/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1522884070&sr=8-2&keywords=movements+of+movements+jai+sen>,MOM1Flipkart
>>> <https://www.flipkart.com/the-movements-of-movements/p/itmf3zg7h79ecpgj?pid=9789387280106&lid=LSTBOK9789387280106NBA1CH&marketplace=FLIPKART&srno=s_1_1&otracker=search&fm=SEARCH&iid=ff35b702-e6a8-4423-b014-16c84f6f0092.9789387280106.SEARCH&ppt=Search%20Page>,
>>> andMOM1AUpFront <http://www.authorsupfront.com/movements.htm>
>>>
>>> Jai Sen, ed, 2017 –*/The Movements of Movements, Part 1 : What
>>> Makes Us Move ?/*.New Delhi : OpenWord and Oakland, CA :PM
>>> Press.Ebook and hard copy available atPM Press
>>> <http://www.pmpress.org/>//
>>>
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>>
>> ________________________________________
>> ** Inspired by the World Social Forum, WSMDiscuss – the successor to a list named ‘WSFDiscuss’ started in 2005 - is an open, unmoderated, and self-organising forum for the exchange of information and views on the experience, practice, and theory of social and political movement at any level (local, national, regional, and global), including the World Social Forum. Join in ! **
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> ________________________________________
> ** Inspired by the World Social Forum, WSMDiscuss – the successor
> to a list named ‘WSFDiscuss’ started in 2005 - is an open,
> unmoderated, and self-organising forum for the exchange of
> information and views on the experience, practice, and theory of
> social and political movement at any level (local, national,
> regional, and global), including the World Social Forum. Join in ! **
> _______________________________________________
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