[WSMDiscuss] [REDlistserve] El Salvador looks to become first country in the world to adopt bitcoin as legal tender

[Sajai Jose]

Dear Frank,

You seem to understand bitcoin, and see it as a positive development
overall.

  This Is What Happens When Bitcoin Miners Take Over Your Town'
https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2018/03/09/bitcoin-mining-energy-prices-smalltown-feature-217230/

i also read this article, which Alex posted - truly a horrifying picture,
and somewhat incomprehensible to someone like me who is far removed from
the site of action. going by this, it seems to be just another gold rush,
one that makes fortunes for some, and leaves behind a lot of wreckage,
socially and materially [that is also to say, ecologically]. its net effect
seems to me destructive on all these counts - despite the gas it keeps from
flaring [surely an unintended grace].

People who understand technology tend to be technophiles (as with
everything else, there are exceptions), and seem to always concentrate on
its positive side. That is to say, technology shapes their attitude, as
invariably happens when you engage with something much bigger than you.

On the other hand, those who don't understand it are likely to be
technophobic at some level, focusing on the negative aspect [i'll admit to
being one of these. that is to say, my attitude to technology is shaped by
my ignorance of it, just as yours is shaped by your knowledge of it]. So
this may be a dialogue between two people with no common language, held
across a chasm that possibly cannot be bridged.
With that caveat, I feel that the part of the problem is how you approach
it - do you look at the part or the whole? I feel Woody Guthrie was wrong,
a dictator is just a king who controls the electricity, so to speak. Which
king ever enjoyed the kind of power, or exert the kind of control, that the
average dictator holds? And where else does this power and control come
from but 'electricity', that is to say, from the grid, from technology?
[incidentally, this was not the only thing he was wrong about - that land
does not belong to "you and me" - but he made good music, so all is
forgiven]

if you look at the part, you only see the many incremental gains and the
many scattered and [likely] transient liberations [for some] that
technology has brought about - if you look at the whole, you see a global
techno-industrial civilisation, the technosphere that has become a parasite
on the biosphere, [quite apart from its direct human and social costs] has
altered or destabilised every planetary system and has endangered life
itself. .

the benefits - political or social or economic - brought by technology are
incremental and transient, but the costs are cumulative and permanent.
climate change alone, for example, can undo all the so-called gains of the
modern era, while simultaneously victimising further most of the indigenous
peoples of the world and the exploited masses who have already had to bear
the cost of building the modern techno-industrial system, apart from the
destruction of other species. their fate resembles those prisoners in the
gulag who were forced to dig their own graves.

how do two centuries of convenience and prosperity for some weigh against
the destruction of indigenous and subject peoples across the world, and
destabilisation of the very systems that support life? to defend the
incremental gains and transient liberations of technology [by this i mean
modern industrial technology - technology in its broadest sense is a
different matter altogether] is to apologise for this life-destroying
system, and ultimately to commit collective suicide.

to sum up, at the very least, we need to rethink technology: its scale, its
complexity, its political economy, its benefits vs its cost, its purpose,
whether its present form can be altered, and so on. [Its a different matter
whether we can, though. After all, the genie's been long out of the bottle
- and seems to like it there. It will probably have to run its course.]

Looking forward to your response

Sajai



On Fri, Jun 11, 2021 at 3:44 AM Frank Kashner via WSM-Discuss <
wsm-discuss at lists.openspaceforum.net> wrote:

> Jai, I replied to post earlier but made the mistake of changing the
> topic.  I hope this gets to the list.  Thanks,  Frank
>
>  Bitcoin creation, aka mining, is an energy intensive process that
> secures a secure, worldwide, decentralized network.  When mining energy
> comes from coal, it is as polluting as any other coal electrical
> generation.  When the energy comes from otherwise unused hydroelectric,
> solar, or gas that would otherwise be flared, it is energy saving.
>
> For China, the question of shutting down coal reliant bitcoin mines
> overlaps their use of coal in general, including building new coal burning
> plants.  China also overbuilt many hydroelectric plants, anticipating
> population growth in the future. Bitcoin miners at those plants were
> supplanted by the plant operators themselves, who support entire
> communities by mining otherwise wasted capacity. Nigeria is leading Africa
> in peer to peer adoption.
>
> Every regime, especially the US, as the owner of the world’s reserve
> currency, must decide how they will respond to bitcoin, a decentralized and
> deflationary currency over which they have little control. Many countries
> are considering issuing their own national “coin”, that is, a digital
> dollar, or yuan, or Euro which they would control.  The only thing these
> coins have in common with Bitcoin is that they are digital.  Venezuela
> already issued one which was a flop.
>
> Whether bitcoin challenges capitalism is like asking, did electricity end
> feudalism? The advancement of democracy has a relationship to technological
> progress, but seldom in a straight line.  At a time of great ideological
> debate, Woody Guthrie famously said, “Don't like dictators not much,
> myself, But I think the whole country ought to be run. By electricity!”
>
> Everyone on this list should become familiar with Bitcoin.  It will be
> considered as important an invention as the Internet itself.  While it does
> not change the distribution of wealth at the top, it offers people at the
> middle and bottom ways to send money home quickly and cheaply, a “banking
> system” that does not require banks, and, for those who can save anything,
> a way to escape hyper-inflation. When the Venezuelan military confiscates
> mining equipment, they then re-install and operate it themselves.
>
> At minimum, Bitcoin is replacing gold as a store of value, despite its
> wild price fluctuations. Coupled with the Lightning network, it will offer
> a world wide disintermediated payment system. It is a cryptographic,
> mathematical, and programmatic advancement. Julian Assange argues that
> cryptography is a most important tool for anyone who wants ways to be
> independent of surveillance states, which now include almost every
> government in the world.
>
> It is being used by countries under US sanctions to continue economic
> activity, and by individuals around the world to exchange value with others
> within and outside of their own country. Iran suspended bitcoin mining only
> for a few peak energy months and will resume after that.  It is entirely
> different from India’s demonetization policy which was a vehicle to steal
> billions from the people of India.
>
> While many people associated with Bitcoin can be characterized as
> Libertarian Conservatives, there is room and need for Libertarian
> Socialists to find ideological footing.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Jun 10, 2021 at 2:15 PM Jai Sen <jai.sen at cacim.net> wrote:
>
>> Thursday, June 10, 2021
>>
>>
>>
>> Hello, to all those who have replied to / otherwise engaged with my post
>> back on Monday, June 7
>>
>>             (Just to make this clear, though I’m replying here
>> immediately to a post and exchange that took place only on WSMDiscuss, till
>> three posts ago the exchange on this issue was vigorously taking place both
>> on WSMDiscuss and on RED – and with some very useful points made by RED
>> subscribers cc to WSMDiscuss; and I'm therefore ccing RED back in here.)
>>
>>             In some ways, and in particular, and speaking only for myself
>> of course, thanks to all those who have posted links towards better
>> understanding just what Bitcoins are and what the Bitcoin economy is about,
>> and also raising associated issues such as energy related.  (And even if I
>> openly admit that I haven’t been able to look at all of them – this
>> overload being one of the problems of the ease of giving links ! : -)  )
>>
>>             This said, and while I appreciate that it is of course
>> important to know what Bitcoins are and what the Bitcoin economy is about –
>> including its wider implications -, my sense is that we’ve not yet
>> addressed the (other) fundamental issue that I tried to raise in my
>> original post :
>>
>> “… the part that interests me is the social (and political) basis on
>> which El Salvador’s President is selling his move : *That it will
>> “include” the “70% of El Salvador’s population does not have a bank account
>> and works in the informal economy”*.  [And specifically, the president
>> Nayib Bukele arguing that what he’s doing is ‘all about and for the
>> majority that is poor / the migrant workers / etc’.]  Any comments, from
>> those who understand this field ?  Because the implications, and
>> repercussions, of this step are huge, for economies – and rulers - across
>> the world.”
>>
>>            As I see it, this is an argument in favour of bitcoin I’ve not
>> heard before, but is of course a populist rationale that I’m sure will now
>> be picked up widely, by leaders of government and public opinion elsewhere,
>> from the right and the left, and citing this case.  Just as, say, so-called
>> ‘demonetisation’ was enacted and sold in India, a few years ago, in the
>> name of breaking the so-called ‘black market’ economy, and through this,
>> ‘saving the poor’.  (And was therefore actually a massive assault on the
>> poor and on the so-called ‘informal sector’, and especially on women in
>> this sector.)
>>
>> And so where we who are critical of this, and who are alive to the
>> dangers of populist policies, therefore need now to engage with this aspect
>> – and try and take positions on what ‘we’ want to do about this within the
>> contexts we live and work in.
>>
>>             Any comments ?
>>
>>             Jai
>>
>> On Jun 8, 2021, at 1:51 PM, Brian <brian at radicalroad.com> wrote:
>>
>> Indeed.  And consider as well the qualities of the Bukele regime in El Salvador,
>> and whose interests such a policy actually intends to serve...
>>
>> https://thebaffler.com/latest/new-problems-old-ideas-gressier
>> <https://thebaffler.com/latest/new-problems-old-ideas-gressier?utm_source=Baffler+Readers&utm_campaign=4c4ca1c2d2-weekly_05262021&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_3541d01f8a-4c4ca1c2d2-46810876>
>>
>> New Problems, Old Ideas Nayib Bukele dismantles El Salvador’s fledgling
>> democracy
>>
>> Roman Gressier <https://thebaffler.com/authors/roman-gressier>, *The
>> Baffler*, May 20, 2021
>>
>> Brian
>>
>> On 8 Jun 2021, at 10:33 am, francine mestrum via WSM-Discuss <
>> wsm-discuss at lists.openspaceforum.net> wrote:
>>
>> please do not ignore the gigantic energy consumption it requires.
>>
>> Francine
>> On 08/06/2021 12:00, Rosamma Thomas via WSM-Discuss wrote:
>>
>>
>> https://www.cnbc.com/2021/06/08/bitcoin-btc-price-slides-as-us-seizes-most-of-colonial-ransom.html?__source=sharebar|twitter&par=sharebar
>>
>> On Tue, Jun 8, 2021 at 3:27 PM helena <h.paul at gn.apc.org> wrote:
>>
>>> Just quick thoughts:
>>> I would call cryptocurrencies ultimate capitalism. Currencies in markets
>>> change value all the time. The changes with crypto are so much bigger.
>>> 'Blockchain makes decentralisation possible….' Yes for those who are in,
>>> not for those who are outside that blockchain.
>>> I think Iran found its electricity supply seriously depleted because
>>> crypto-operators had moved in – this is a real problem.
>>> El Salvador is a fearsome regime, isn’t it, with people fleeing from it
>>> constantly?
>>> Helena
>>>
>>>
>>> From: <radical_ecological_democracy at googlegroups.com> on behalf of
>>> Ashish Kothari <ashishkothari at riseup.net>
>>> Date: Tuesday, 8 June 2021 at 10:46
>>> To: James Pochury <jamespoch at gmail.com>
>>> Cc: Post WSMDiscuss <wsm-discuss at lists.openspaceforum.net>, Post RED <
>>> radical_ecological_democracy at googlegroups.com>
>>> Subject: Re: [REDlistserve] El Salvador looks to become first country
>>> in the world to adopt bitcoin as legal tender
>>>
>>> But what about this? (and there are many more such reports):
>>>
>>>
>>> https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2021/feb/27/bitcoin-mining-electricity-use-environmental-impact
>>>
>>> Democracy that comes at a huge ecological cost is not, well, democracy!
>>> But, like Jai, then I don't understand much about all this, so perhaps
>>> someoen can enlighten.
>>>
>>> Also, are all cryptocurrencies likely to cause such ecological impacts,
>>> or are some different ...and if so, how?
>>>
>>> I also did not understand this, James: "blockchain is a network of
>>> millions of computers .... makes decentralisation possible" ... and then
>>> "authoritarian regimes don't want to let in existing cryptos ... would
>>> ratehr create their own Blockchain & crypto currency" ... now is
>>> blockchain/cryptos are inherently decentralised, would not authoritarian
>>> regimes risk their own power by setting up their own?
>>>
>>> Finally, do any of these fundamentally challenge capitalism (and in the
>>> above qs, statism), or are they 'reforms' within the existing structures?
>>>
>>> thanks to anyone, who can respond to these qs.
>>>
>>> ashish
>>> On 08/06/21 3:03 pm, James Pochury wrote:
>>>
>>> One bitcoin had almost touched 50,000 USD. Right now it is hovering
>>> around 36,000. You can own a fraction of bitcoin, including by giving a
>>> fraction to the 70% of the informal economy and over a period of time, the
>>> value increases benefitting them.
>>>
>>> There are atleast 5000 cryptocurrencies and counting. Etherium is at no.
>>> 2 in terms of value.
>>>
>>> The decentralised nature of cryptocurrency, with crowdfunding approach
>>> in many cases, makes it a viable and political project with huge potential
>>> for the masses.
>>>
>>> Blockchain technology is the engine that drives cryptocurrency.
>>> Blockchain is a network of millions of computers across the world wired
>>> together through a software platform. Blockchain makes decentralisation
>>> possible. A reason why authoritarian regimes don't want to let in existing
>>> cryptos into their countries. They would rather create their own Blockchain
>>> and crypto currency.
>>>
>>> Blockchain is also poised to be used for many other sectors, including
>>> financial, health, educational institutions, communications,
>>> transportation, trade, etc.
>>>
>>> James
>>>
>>> On Tue, 8 Jun 2021, 02:01 Jai Sen, <jai.sen at cacim.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Monday, June 7, 2021
>>>>
>>>> *El Salvador in movement…, **Ideas in movement…, **History in
>>>> movement…, Economies in movement…*
>>>>
>>>> [I know nothing about Bitcoin, and my last attempt – this last weekend
>>>> - to try to understand (by reading an article on it) resulted in my bailing
>>>> out.  But that’s not the point : A day later, I see this article, and the
>>>> part that interests me is the social (and political) basis on which E;
>>>> Salvador’s President is selling his move : *That it will “include” the
>>>> “70% of El Salvador’s population does not have a bank account and works in
>>>> the informal economy”*.  Any comments, from those who understand this
>>>> field ?  Because it seems to me that the implications, and repercussions,
>>>> of this step are huge, for economies – and rulers - across the world :
>>>>
>>>> “Next week I will send to Congress a bill that will make Bitcoin a
>>>> legal tender in El Salvador,” Bukele said in the message Saturday. “In the
>>>> short term this will generate jobs and help provide financial inclusion to
>>>> thousands outside the formal economy and in the medium and long term we
>>>> hope that this small decision can help us push humanity at least a tiny bit
>>>> into the right direction.”
>>>>
>>>> The U.S. dollar is El Salvador’s official currency. About one quarter
>>>> of El Salvador’s citizens live in the United States and last year, despite
>>>> the pandemic, they sent home more than $6 billion in remittances.
>>>>
>>>> Stephen McKeon, a finance professor at the University of Oregon who
>>>> studies cryptocurrencies, said Bitcoin is legal to own in most countries
>>>> but has never been designated as legal tender, which would mean it could be
>>>> used to to settle financial obligations, including taxes.
>>>>
>>>> But, he added, “It is unclear whether anyone desires to pay their taxes
>>>> in Bitcoin.”
>>>>
>>>> Additional details of the plan were not released. But Bukele in
>>>> subsequent messages on Twitter noted that Bitcoin could be “the fastest
>>>> growing way to transfer six billion dollars a year in remittances.” He said
>>>> that a big chunk of those money transfers were currently lost to
>>>> intermediaries and with Bitcoin more than a million low-income families
>>>> could benefit.
>>>>
>>>> He also said 70% of El Salvador’s population does not have a bank
>>>> account and works in the informal economy. Bitcoin could improve financial
>>>> inclusion, he said.
>>>>
>>>> *El Salvador looks to become first country in the world to adopt
>>>> bitcoin as legal tender*
>>>>
>>>> Associated Press
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> https://www.theglobeandmail.com/business/international-business/article-el-salvador-president-plans-to-make-bitcoin-legal-tender/?symbol=print-msg
>>>>
>>>> El Salvador President Nayib Bukele, pictured after a news conference in
>>>> San Salvador on June 6, 2021, wants to make Bitcoin legal tender in his
>>>> country.  (JOSE CABEZAS/Reuters)
>>>>
>>>> El Salvador President Nayib Bukele announced in a recorded message
>>>> played at a Bitcoin conference in Miami that next week he will send
>>>> proposed legislation to the country’s congress that would make the
>>>> cryptocurrency legal tender in the Central American nation.
>>>>
>>>> The 39-year-old president, who has maintained approval ratings above
>>>> 90% and made Twitter his preferred way of communicating, characterized it
>>>> as an idea that could help El Salvador move forward.
>>>>
>>>> “Next week I will send to Congress a bill that will make Bitcoin a
>>>> legal tender in El Salvador,” Bukele said in the message Saturday. “In the
>>>> short term this will generate jobs and help provide financial inclusion to
>>>> thousands outside the formal economy and in the medium and long term we
>>>> hope that this small decision can help us push humanity at least a tiny bit
>>>> into the right direction.”
>>>>
>>>> The U.S. dollar is El Salvador’s official currency. About one quarter
>>>> of El Salvador’s citizens live in the United States and last year, despite
>>>> the pandemic, they sent home more than $6 billion in remittances.
>>>>
>>>> Stephen McKeon, a finance professor at the University of Oregon who
>>>> studies cryptocurrencies, said Bitcoin is legal to own in most countries
>>>> but has never been designated as legal tender, which would mean it could be
>>>> used to to settle financial obligations, including taxes.
>>>>
>>>> But, he added, “It is unclear whether anyone desires to pay their taxes
>>>> in Bitcoin.”
>>>>
>>>> Bukele’s New Ideas party holds a supermajority in the new congress
>>>> seated May 1, giving any legislative proposal from the president a strong
>>>> likelihood of passage.
>>>>
>>>> Additional details of the plan were not released. But Bukele in
>>>> subsequent messages on Twitter noted that Bitcoin could be “the fastest
>>>> growing way to transfer six billion dollars a year in remittances.” He said
>>>> that a big chunk of those money transfers were currently lost to
>>>> intermediaries and with Bitcoin more than a million low-income families
>>>> could benefit.
>>>>
>>>> He also said 70% of El Salvador’s population does not have a bank
>>>> account and works in the informal economy. Bitcoin could improve financial
>>>> inclusion, he said.
>>>>
>>>> Riding his high popularity and his party’s dominance performance in
>>>> Feb. 28 elections, Bukele has concentrated power. His party’s supermajority
>>>> in congress ousted the justices of the Constitutional Chamber of the
>>>> Supreme Court May 1. They then replaced the attorney general.
>>>>
>>>> They had been critical of some of Bukele’s more drastic measures during
>>>> the pandemic, including a mandatory stay-at-home order and containment
>>>> centres where those caught violating the policy were detained.
>>>>
>>>> While enjoying a positive relationship with former U.S. President
>>>> Donald Trump, Bukele has had a much more tense relationship with the
>>>> administration of President Joe Biden.
>>>>
>>>> Last month, the White House Special Envoy for the Northern Triangle
>>>> Ricardo Zuniga said during a visit to El Salvador that the U.S. government
>>>> would like to see El Salvador reverse the moves against the court and the
>>>> attorney general. Bukele said that would not happen.
>>>>
>>>> Bukele’s concentration of power, attacks on critics and open disdain
>>>> for checks on his power have raised concerns about El Salvador’s path.
>>>> However, Bukele has a wide base of support in part due to the utter failure
>>>> of the country’s traditional parties who ruled during the past 30 years to
>>>> improve people’s lives and to his ability to provide short-term benefits.
>>>>
>>>> Bukele has been praised for aggressively obtaining COVID-19 vaccines
>>>> and running an efficient vaccination program far more successful than El
>>>> Salvador’s neighbours.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
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>>>>
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>>> --
>>>
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>>>
>>> Ashish Kothari
>>>
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>>>
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>>
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>>
>> ____________________________
>>
>> Jai Sen
>>
>> Independent researcher, editor; Senior Fellow at the School of
>> International Development and Globalisation Studies at the University of
>> Ottawa
>>
>> jai.sen at cacim.net &  <jsen at uottawa.ca>jsen at uottawa.ca
>>
>> Now based in Ottawa, Canada, on unsurrendered Anishinaabe territory (+1-613-282
>> 2900) and in New Delhi, India (+91-98189 11325)
>>
>> *Check out something new** – including for copies of the first two books
>> below, at a discount, and much more : **The Movements of Movements
>> <https://movementsofmovements.net/>*
>>
>> Jai Sen, ed, 2017 – *The Movements of Movements, Part 1 : What Makes Us
>> Move ?*.  New Delhi : OpenWord and Oakland, CA : PM Press.  Ebook and
>> hard copy available at PM Press <http://www.pmpress.org/>; hard copy
>> only also at The Movements of Movements
>> <https://movementsofmovements.net/>
>>
>> Jai Sen, ed, 2018a – *The Movements of Movements, Part 2 : Rethinking
>> Our Dance*.  Ebook and hard copy available at PM Press
>> <http://www.pmpress.org/>; hard copy only also at The Movements of
>> Movements <https://movementsofmovements.net/>
>>
>> Jai Sen, ed, 2018b – *The Movements of Movements, Part 1 : What Makes Us
>> Move ?*  (Indian edition). New Delhi : AuthorsUpfront, in collaboration
>> with OpenWord and PM Press.  Hard copy available at MOM1AmazonIN
>> <https://www.amazon.in/dp/9387280101/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1522884070&sr=8-2&keywords=movements+of+movements+jai+sen>
>> , MOM1Flipkart
>> <https://www.flipkart.com/the-movements-of-movements/p/itmf3zg7h79ecpgj?pid=9789387280106&lid=LSTBOK9789387280106NBA1CH&marketplace=FLIPKART&srno=s_1_1&otracker=search&fm=SEARCH&iid=ff35b702-e6a8-4423-b014-16c84f6f0092.9789387280106.SEARCH&ppt=Search%20Page>,
>> and MOM1AUpFront <http://www.authorsupfront.com/movements.htm>
>>
>> *SUBSCRIBE TO World Social Movement Discuss*, an open, unmoderated, and
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> ________________________________________
> ** Inspired by the World Social Forum, WSMDiscuss – the successor to a
> list named ‘WSFDiscuss’ started in 2005 - is an open, unmoderated, and
> self-organising forum for the exchange of information and views on the
> experience, practice, and theory of social and political movement at any
> level (local, national, regional, and global), including the World Social
> Forum.  Join in ! **
> _______________________________________________
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